you have just got to love the ESR intakes....

OK...you actually don't .... but i do...

some of the reasons i love them aren't really valid reasons to buy a high performance item..... but logic only goes so far

in no particular order:

1) Inexpensive.... as far as i know they are the least expensive of all

2) BIG filter.... self explanatory

3) Hollow Billet mounting bracket...i have a weakness for lightened billet anything

4) Aluminum....light...doesn't corrode easily...and i love the look of aluminum (one of the not so valid reasons...but i love aluminum)

5) Fun to modify... if you like to mess with everything you have...this gives you something to customize ... (could also be easily viewed as a negative feature)

6) works awesome with the Venom RAT .... more billet aluminum...and i am VERY fond of the RAT design for some reason

ANYWHO.....

the ESR is a nice piece as delivered....but it could certainly use some work where the 2 diameter tubes come together...and that is an understatement!!

dwp138 sent a new ESR to me .... i told him i would mod it and send it to him no charge if i could use it to take pics for a ESR modding thread....

the filter came yesterday...and guess what??..... it was for a yfz450

i had a new, already modded (naturally ) ESR for the 04-05TRX on hand, since i like to have spare EVERYTHING

soooooo.... i'm going to send him the already modded tube with the rest f his new stuff...and have a freshly modded yfz esr setup....maybe i can convince my wife i need a new yfz to go with the new filter setup...you know, complete the package

lots of pics coming via dial-up... please be patient and wait till i've got em all up before responding


first pic...

TRX 04-05 tube , complete with cool hollow billet mount on left ..
YFZ tube on the right

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shot of the hollow billet mount...the end is perfectly shaped to fit within the cutout of the of the left seat post's window

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and here is what you will need to do the mod...the whole stick..

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.....you just like cutting them shorter.... and having the shop smell JB. lol. jk



they are really easy to tune.

sorry: thought you were done with the pics

couple pics of why you need to do the mod...hope they work well enough to illustrate....abrupt angles and sharp edges don't make for the best airflow

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one more fugly junction pic

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you don't really need to cut & blend the air filter to tube junction...

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but what the heck...a cfm is a cfm...

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thats weird cuz my esr does look anything like that.. It doesn't have a mount, and the transition points are alll very very smooth.. I actually took steel wool and polished the inside to make for a tiny bit better airflow..

I love me ESR though!!!

does anyone have a part # on replacement filters for these though.. I need a couple extras

a much more efficient airflow path ...smooth blended junction for $5 worth of epoxy

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another trick for a smooth junction in the flow path.... don't have the intake tube extend past the inside of the filter mounting flange....mount it about 1/4' shallow

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i either mark mine with a paint or a tape line for easy depth reference on the install


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wierder still is that i have worked on plenty of ESR intakes... 04-05TRX's ...06~07 TRX's ...yfz450's... ltz400's

and all of them use the same 2 pieces to make the junction....

and all of them looked exactly like the one i just pictured

and of course....they work a WHOLE LOT BETTER with a VENOM RAT on the back of your FCR

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looks purdy installed...even though you can't see the inside work

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Thanks ALOT mixxer, had been waiting for this, mine is in the mail!!!

Anything different for a stock carb or does all the same apply?

one more time...side by side...

does anybody see a potential difference in airflow??

[attachmentid=16000][attachmentid=16001]

By modifying the ESR intake, two things are occuring. Smoothing out the transitions makes for less turbulent airflow, while also being tapered down to the smaller tube creating more velocity. Both of these attributes are obviously a good thing. Is that what your looking for?

I guess my semi-related questions would be: Does the modified (or unmodified) ESR show a wavy A/F graph (presumably caused by harmonic resonance) like has been shown in A/F graphs of the Fuel Customs intake? I'm not trying to bash FC in any way. Their intake has been shown to produce great results on the dyno, and I'm still very much considering one myself. I'm just curious to know if all aftermarket intakes have this same problem/occurence, since the resonance chamber on the stock boot is not utilized with any aftermarket intakes.

yep... smooth airflow at high velocity is always a main objective of mine...

the resonance\harmonic thing will occur in all intakes...differently with different shapes and lengths...only honda addresses this with its resonators..and has been since the days of the trx250r...gotta love them honda fellers!

in the testing i have seen from several sources....the fci needs a disproportionately large increase in main jet (220) and needle richness (bottom clip)....and i haven't seen anyone tune out the pronounced roller coaster A\FR graphs....the torque and hp seems to be there though

i have seen\noted each intake to have different harmonics...and the engine components change the way they work also..... i have had luck with the ESR's ...and you can cut or extend them easily if you need to, in order to tune them in to your particular setup

not saying they are better or worse than anything else for anybody's application...only that i like them..and i like working with them

thanks!

Has anybody dynoed the stocker w/harmonic balancer thing, no airbox and K&N vs. ESR or FCI?

I have not put alot of thought into a new intake. Do they help make more power over the stocker?

(Blue) Stock boot w/resonating chamber utilizing ESR filter

(Red) Modded ESR intake

With Ron Wood exhaust
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With Pulse Charger exhaust
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Those graphs do not look all that dissimilar, but there are some differences.

The ESR intake was easier to get a good A/Fr line, and it was easier to get a smooth power curve. Just more verification that different intake harmonics do different things to different builds.


And just to reiterate the "lip" on the inside of the ESR as it comes......it's horrible, almost shameful.

So why hasnt Eddie corrected this issue....

to me....it would be SO MUCH EASIER if Eddie would correct this issue and CNC this part correctly......so it matches.... couldnt cost 'that' much more to do this......

and he would have one heck of an intake......instead of buying a new item..then having to customize it so it works correctly....

what ever happened to F.C.?





John...when are those RATS ready for shipment?

mixxer great information. I'm not trying to change the subject but you seem to know alot about intakes, so here goes. I have a 04 yfz 450 with full nmotion exhaust, fci, hot cam intake(your cam shootout saved me some cash, thanks), and cammod. I run a 162 main, 5th clip on dynojet needle, and a 45 pilot. Before the exhaust and intake I was running a 160 main, 5th clip on dyno jet needle, and 42 pilot, it seemed to run fine but I don't have access to a dyno so who knows. Anyway, I a tried larger main jets, 165 and 168, and I was too rich. I don't understand this because everyone else said the main increased tremendously, why wouldn't mine?

thanks

nice mixx thx

I seem to remember you saying that you were going to be selling these esr thingies
and if so will you be selling them stock or modded?

and the final question is whats a modded (if offered) one with one of your rats going to cost a smuck like me?

Not to be picky, but if you have questions off topic just shoot him a PM or start a new topic, just keeps things organized. Plus if its in its own topic then it could help other people out with the same problem cuz they most likely wont run into the answer if its posted here.

oh and another question are all these intakes melted through?

[quote=450RRR,Sep 28 2006, 06:59 PM]
So why hasnt Eddie corrected this issue....

to me....it would be SO MUCH EASIER if Eddie would correct this issue and CNC this part correctly......so it matches.... couldnt cost 'that' much more to do this......

I think he's busy moving shop to Pismo . Whats going on Greg? Have you heard if ESR is still going to keep there facility here in Visalia or are they moving everything to the coast?

hey where do you get one of those little k&n filters for the breather tube in the air box?

Im pretty sure that specifc one in his picture is the one you can order from ESR (Universal Case Breather) for $15. You can get one just like it at any auto parts store for the same or less. Most likely less.

cool, thanks. i'll try and look at Auto-Zone to see if they have it, if not ill get it from ESR.

BTW, do you know if you are supposed to put K&N filter oil on it or just leave it dry?

Eddie is using 2 different diameter tubes and cutting them to make whatever angle is needed at the intersection.... you couldn't correct for the problem with simple machining because the tubes need to fit together at an angle to be welded

i think they are close to as good as they can get, given the fitment angles...and the fact that the same basic pieces have to be cut at different angles to fit all models of machines

the best solution is to put an extra $5 towards a stick of epoxy and get your hands dirty...

production RATs available early next week

Yes sir, oil it up after cleaning.

when i had my yfz similarly modded to yours, i had a 162~ 165 main in it with the ESR intake

swapping intakes doesn't guarantee you will need to change your jetting...and every engine setup behaves a little differently

all the ones i have seen have a bit of weld protruding to the inside

yep!

i was thinking about selling them in modded form.....

the RATs themselves will go for $65 + shipping (probably $5)

If you DO want to cut and blend your intake... Is there a good length to generally cut to, or is it a case by case basis? At the very least I like the idea of blending it to create a smooth transition the whole way.

different for each bike....

Selling them in modded form is a great idea Mix. People would probably rather a proffessional like yourself do so they can just bolt and ride. Plus, you seem to like it so much, think of al the hours of fun you will have

I love inexpensive mods Thanks Mixxer, good stuff. With this set up does anyone have clearance problems with the filter to seat area? Mine rubbed against the seat and rubbed a hole in the filter skin.

Interestingly enough, I have been working on intake modifications concurrently and also have some VERY interesting information to share shortly, but I do not have it complete yet I am done with my testing but I have to cam swap again, then rerun some dyno's but what I am seeing is absolute proof regarding intake modding, harmonics, and tuned lenght - to get results. I should be able to post before and after results as well as an entire scientific approach. This intake topic is not revolutionaly... just never fully explained...

no problems for me since ESR started to inclued a billet mount ...before that, only the yfz had a mount....no mount meant more movement and possible contact on the TRX & LTZ's

cool to hear Vader

this topic is not new by any means... it is just new to the vast majority of engine builders in our sport

can't wait for your results

I have no idea about Eddie moving to Pismo.........cost of him and his 'team' to move would be quite a bit more expensive for housing.......far more so than here in Central Cali.....plus he is much closer to shipping areas here....

so not sure what he would benifit...other than He himself could live on the Beach....

they have expanded their shop here over the years.....he now occupies quite a bit more space than just a few years ago...so I would say business is good.......


if they do move........i wont be able to walk in their shop and 'peak' around at all the cool billet stuff.....Mixxer would love a visit to his shop....


p.s......IF...and i say IF...cuzz not sure how it effects using with or w/o stock box....but why does HRC recommend the removal the resognating chamber when modding the 450R if it helps reduce intake harmonic issues?

just curious....Greg

good question, I been wondering the same thing.

because when you change the cam and pull the lid off the airbox.... you totally change the dynamics of the intake....Honda has it tuned for box stock as it comes....

honda has likely determined the plugging of the resonator works better for the harmonics of the HRC modded version

Interestingly enough, I have been working on intake modifications concurrently and also have some VERY interesting information to share shortly, but I do not have it complete yet I am done with my testing but I have to cam swap again, then rerun some dyno's but what I am seeing is absolute proof regarding intake modding, harmonics, and tuned lenght - to get results. I should be able to post before and after results as well as an entire scientific approach. This intake topic is not revolutionaly... just never fully explained...
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We have been messing with intake stuff now for 3 years on these bikes. Let me tell you,there is alot vairables that can change everything. cam,carb,portjob and one of the biggest vairables is the exhuast and intake combo.Talking Harmonically, Highly active pipe"megaphone type or multi step " with a highly active intake "FCI" there is bigger chance to get it wrong than get it right. On the other hand when you get it right the benefits are outstanding.Vader dont be suprized if the somthings change, when you change the cam. Esr intake mod is some good stuff but to say it works on every bike, you cant. The funny thing is with this, everything that mixxer fixed on this intake, our intake doesnt have any trouble with. Even our filter placement like mixxer has stated is right on. but you still see on certain applications a harmonic issue or tunning issue.
When we made our intake system for the 04/05 we started with a bone stock bike with a Yoshi exhuast. We saw a gain of 1 to 2hp gain over the Dasa intake system consistantly. with a awesome afr reading. Then we built the bike,highcomp,ported ,cam,changed the pipe to a DASA and we saw a 3hp gain in the mid range and about 1/2hp up top, between the same intakes.. Both were with the stockcarb. We never did come across any of the problems with afr. We are now currently testing the whole setup again with 43.5 fcr trying to simlate these lean spikes that some of you are getting.Once we see if there is an issue we have plenty of things that we can do to help it. Resonators,etc... we will also be able to help with jetting more becuase i see alot of you run the fcr carb.. On the 06/07 models our intake kits will come with Rat type insert also just like our yfz model. Stay tuned guys, we have alot interesting info to give here shortly!

450rrrr when we tested the resonator on the stock system, what we saw is that it helped fill the mid range but made the power drop off quicker. That was in the box. It had the same effect when we tested it without box.

sounds like interesting things are coming.

are you going to make changes to the design of your intake or just make the original better.

i am going to purchase one and guess i'll wait till the tests are over.

If you have a stock carb the intake should work great the way it is.
We will be testing the fcr to see what we get as far as the afr goes!

if dyno testing and A\FR sorting was actually performed on the machines at hand.... it adds a lot to the reading on the topic if the actual dyno runs and A\FR readings are given...

in other words...

post them if you've got them

then thre can be tech talk based on testing.... instead of speculation

I will post some runs for sure..

I was just about to pop some myself!

okay, I'm back....

what did I miss while out playing?